Het vervolg op een oude blog van Michael Gungor, dat hij schreef in een opwelling, maar daarmee wel de spijker op de kop sloeg? Na het terugtrekken van het blog, bleef de blog steeds weer overal opduiken. Is de scherpe conclusie van Michael Gungor sinds 2011 nog steeds actueel? Lees hier de reactie van Gungor op het steeds weer oplevende blog en het stof dat het wederom op doet waaien.

The blog that won’t die

There is this blog that I wrote a couple years ago making its way around the internet again the last few days.  It’s a spicy little rant that I wrote on a plane as I was coming home from a long “Christian music” tour, and I was tired, cranky and sick of the copious loads of b.s. that I had continually encountered in the religious circles that I found myself in.

The blog was angry.  It wasn’t all that articulate or even very well thought through, but it did call a spade and some people appreciated that.  Of course, it made some people angry too.  Some said that I was arrogant and cynical, and maybe I was.

I ended up deleting the blog because, as I thought about it and discussed the issue through the next year, I realized some things. I realized that the issues I was upset about don’t just exist in the tiny bubble that I was living in.  They exist everywhere.  The issues I saw were just a small piece of fruit on a much larger tree planted within a much larger orchard.  I actually ended up writing an entire book about it called The Crowd, the Critic and the Muse.

So imagine my chagrin when my road manager told me a couple of days ago that people were texting him all day about that deleted blog that I wrote years ago…

Why is it that the CCM blog is by far my most “viral” blog ever?  Is it because it’s more true or honest than other blogs I have written?  I don’t think so..  Is it because the content was more informative than other blogs I have written?  No.  I think it is for the same reasons that football is more popular than the symphony.

Both a sports team and an orchestra are made up of highly skilled, highly trained, and highly rehearsed human beings working together for a common purpose. The great athlete and great musician have both put in countless hours of hard work and have achieved a level of mastery both mentally and physically of the ‘game’ that they are playing.  But symphonies don’t pack out stadiums…

So why is it that 50,000 people show up to the football game but only 500 show up to the performance of the Rachmaninoff concerto?

I think it has something to do with the fundamental difference between the nature of the goals of a football team and the goals of an orchestra.  An orchestra rehearses together to focus their talents into a single vision: the piece.  They work together to build something beautiful and grand.  A sports team also must learn to work together, but it is for the purpose of defeating the opposition.  The entire purpose of a sporting event is competition.  An orchestra is more like a construction team trying to build a beautiful piece of architecture together, while the sports team is more like an army trying to defeat an enemy.

When you’re team comes to my town, and my team crushes your team, I somehow feel powerful.  I am on the right side of the battle.  I am part of the winners and we are better than you.  You don’t get that at the symphony.  You don’t really walk away from listening to Bach feeling superior or powerful.  If anything, it is a humbling experience.  An experience of wonder and beauty, but not of conquest or tribal pride.

So, what does this have to do with my blog?

Well, what is it that made this particular blog get shared thousands of times and others get largely ignored?

In my opinion, the infamous CCM blog was not nearly as “beautiful” as other blogs that I actually spent time crafting and shaping.  It was an unedited rant.  Just guttural angst vomited onto a laptop keyboard.  Sure, I think there was truth in it, but I honestly don’t think it was the truth that made it spread.  It was the guts.  The blood.  The lines that could now be drawn in the sand.  Us. Them.  Those of us who feel justified in hating most mainstream Christian music.  Or those of us who love Christian music and see how much of an ass this Gungor guy is.  The battlefield was setup.  Now, go, kill!

I made the mistake of perusing some of the comments that were left on the reposted blog yesterday.  They get really mean.  Name calling and below-the-belt personal attacks on both sides.  Parental warning here.  Some of the comments below are not suitable for young audiences.

“I’ve never called you creative. A copy, yes. Clone, maybe.  Creative, no.”

“The real problem with the “Christian Music Industry” is that Michael Gungor is a part of it. Get a fucking life. Your are a joke just sitting around stirring up meaningless conversation. No one gives a shit about you or your opinions. Asshole.”

“You’re an idiot.”  

“Michael, without a doubt, from this post, you sound like an ignorant, stuck up oaf, attempting to veil your attempts at basin someone who violates a pet peeve of yours…”  

Where there is passionate blood shed, there is social media sharing.

My point here is that I think most human beings in our current mainstream level of consciousness are often drawn more to competition than cooperation, and the result of this is a world that gets divided up into camps of ‘us and them’, and the world is a worse place for it.  The reason that I deleted the blog was not because I was afraid of calling out the b.s. in the Christian music industry, but because I think the way I wrote it was a bit too emotional and narrow.

I say it was narrow because like I have said, the problem does not lie solely within the Christian music industry.  There are plenty of people and industries that wade behind the true innovators and pick up the crumbs to insert their messages into a previously alive creative medium.  There are plenty of TV shows, Disney movies, boy bands and pop albums that are every bit as soulless and zombie-like as the most generic Christian songs on the radio.  And there are songs that have been arguably been created within the somewhat imaginary “Christian music industry” that are full of life and innovation and soul.

So, in hindsight, I think this blog was too narrow and the emotion it was written in a way that lends itself to a fight rather than a discussion.  And for that I am sorry.

What I do stand by after the years that have passed since I wrote this blog is that there is too much fear in the world and we ought to create and behave from a place of passion, belief, and love rather than truing to homogenize, pander, and cater with our art. But while I enjoy making art with an edge that speaks against the things that ought to be spoken against and for the things that ought to be spoken for, I also want my art to be more like a symphony than a football game.

Don’t get me wrong. I’m not anti-competition.  Competition can be good fun and even helpful at times.  But here’s something that we sometimes don’t think about… Competition is not as effective in nature or in human history as cooperation is.

Human beings didn’t evolve to the top of the food chain because we are the biggest, strongest or fastest.  If competition were the highest rule of the universe, then wouldn’t you expect some sort of giant shark-dragon-monster at the top of the food chain that just easily defeats all of its prey with its venomous fire balls or something?  Instead, you have these relatively small, slow, and fragile creatures called human beings who can’t even survive a winter without fire, clothing and shelter.  Sure we can use our opposable thumbs to make weapons, but that’s not really what has made humanity thrive.  It is our developed ability to empathize, communicate, and cooperate with one another.

And this is not just about humans.  If you look at nature, there is love and cooperation everywhere.  Ants building cities together, whales forming families and clans that spend their whole lives together, parents sacrificing their own lives for their offspring, cells working together to keep life going… Cooperation towards a greater good can be found everywhere we look.  In some ways, the most “fit” are not the biggest, strongest and fastest but the the most empathetic and cooperative.

So why don’t we as a society value cooperation as highly as competition?  Why must there be a loser for us to be interested?  Why is the most boring part of American idol when all of the singers sing together?

Because we want blood!  

The result of this type of thinking are a world full of ‘us vs them’. A world plagued with things like concentration camps and bad religion and Roman arena games where thousands are slaughtered for the public’s amusement.  But is this really the kind of world we want to build?

Tribal, competitive thinking allowed for societies to develop certain helpful things through history.  But when these tribes start getting nuclear bombs, the world is in trouble.  I think we are at an important juncture of our development as a species. We either will learn to cooperate and empathize with the “other” or we will continue to try to conquer them.  And if it’s the latter, we are all in trouble.

You see this on a global scale, but you also see it down to a personal scale.  Down to a, “what should I post on my twitter feed?” scale.   The world we live in is built of small decisions. So what kind of world do we want to build?

I, for one, don’t want anything to do with drawing more lines in the sand between people.  I’d rather be a part of trying to erase them.

At this point in my life,  I have no desire to bash Christian music or anybody’s music really.  But I do still think we ought to be wary of the fear and b.s. that plagues not just the religious world but our

world as a whole.  My conclusion about the matter is this: spend your energy on things you believe in, and do them honestly and to the best of your ability.

Meestal blog ik op mijn website niet meteen een blog van een ander zonder er m’n eigen reflectie op te geven, maar bij dit blog kan ik eigenlijk alleen maar slaafs copy-pasten. Het artikel is uit 2011, maar beschrijft voor mij heel scherp het ‘wij/zij-denken’ in de christelijke subcultuur.

The Problem With The Christian Music Industry

When you are in a touring band, there is a lot of time that is spent waiting. Waiting to board a plane, waiting for the bus to arrive at the venue, waiting for sound check…etc One of the many games that people in our band have implemented now and then to fill the waiting time is a little game we might call the “Christian or secular” game. Basically the game is simply playing a very short clip of music and having someone guess whether it is “Christian” or “secular” music. The person who is most accurate with his or her guesses is the winner.

This is surprisingly easy to do.

Especially when you talk about radio stations. It is easy for me to spot a Christian music radio station within about 3 seconds. Far before any Christian lingo is uttered to make it clear.

It’s weird. I’m always trying to figure out what it is that makes something sound like Christian music, because there’s definitely something… I’d love to get some of your thoughts about it. But for me (and I’m actually one of the better players of the game if I must say so myself), I find something very disingenuous about most Christian music. This is something I can simply feel at a gut level. If I hear a song, and I hear any sort of pretending or false emotion, that’s a good first indicator. I’m really not trying to throw mud here, I’m being honest at how I am good at this game. Christian music often has a sheen to it that other music doesn’t have. Some pop and country music has a similar sheen, but the Christian sheen is like a blander sheen somehow.

The vocals are always really hot in the mix because for Christian music, the words are the most important part. That’s kind of similar to country though as well, so you have to be careful there. Country has some of the same Nashville tones, players, and compression styles that Christian music has most of the time, but the twang is just a little deeper with the country side of things. There’s also a little more “humanness” or “soul” in Country to my ears.

The false emotion that I’m talking about might be familiar to some of you. There’s just something more believable about the whispery sexy voice that is singing about sex on the mainstream radio station than the voice that copies that style of singing while putting lyrics in about being in the arms of Jesus. And it’s really not even the style or the lyric that is the problem to me, it’s the fact that I don’t believe that the singer is feeling the kind of emotions in singing that lyric that would lead to that style of singing. It’s that same kind of creep out that you feel when somebody gives a really loud fake laugh. It’s just weird and uncomfortable feeling.

An example of this would be a song that somebody sent us recently of an older song of mine called “Wrap Me In Your Arms.” The lyric is a very intimate and soft sort of lyric. “Take me to that place where I can be with you, you can make me like you…etc” This person did a hardcore/screamo version of this song. Not just like getting a little loud, I mean full out death metal sounding, demon-voiced screaming. It was so freaking weird mostly because it seemed so disingenuous. You would never speak such gentle words to someone you loved by screaming in their face like you were possessed by Beelzebub. That’s an extreme example, but it’s very typical of the basic premise of most Christian music to me, which is–use whatever musical style you wish as a medium to communicate your message. It’s not about the art, it’s about the message. So use whatever tools and mediums you have at your fingertips to do so. If you want to reach emo kids, then sing emo music but with Jesus language. The problem with this is that emo music is not simply reducible to certain sounding tones and chords. There are emotions and attitudes of different genres of music that are the soul of the music. You can’t remove the anger from screamo and have it still be screamo. It’s the soul of that music, whether that soul is good or evil is not the point, simply that it is the soul. So when you remove the soul from music and transplant the body parts (chord changes, instrumentation, dress, lights, and everything but the soul…) and parade it around with some more “positive” lyrics posing as Christian music, then what you have is a musical zombie.

It looks like a human.. It eats like a human… It still walks and makes noise and resembles a human, but it’s not. It’s a zombie. It has no soul. It just uses it’s human body for its own purposes.

This is what I initially feel when I play the “Christian or secular” game. I look into its eyes, and I perceive whether the thing has a soul or not. And 9 times out of ten, I can do it very quickly and efficiently.

Why is this like this? I don’t know, and it makes me very sad. I don’t hate all Christian music. There are a few artists that I know in the Christian industry that are really trying to transcend the inherent limitations and zombying effect of the industry. But the industry as a whole is broken, friends. We call it Christian, but it’s certainly not based in Christianity. It is based on marketing. That’s it. I wish I could tell you otherwise, but it wouldn’t be true.


We just were part of one of the biggest tours of the fall in the Christian music industry. To my knowledge, every night but one night was sold out, and that’s because they added a second show in the same city kind of last minute. The interesting thing about this tour was that it was pretty much in all mainstream venues. Clubs, theatres…etc It was awesome.

But you know what made me sad? That empty bar every night.

Even though these shows were all sold out, I would imagine that the bartenders at all those clubs were like “oh man, Christian night… that means no tips for me.”

Sometimes the promoters would just buy out the bar so there wouldn’t be any liquor sales at all.
I’m not saying that I wished that everybody was getting hammered at the show… But for crying out loud, buy one beer. Or heck, if you don’t drink beer, buy a Coke.

But here’s what is super weird about this situation. I bet you if you took all of those Christians that came to the shows and split them up and had them go to “secular” shows, A LOT of them would have bought a drink. It’s the fact that there is this assumption among all of the Christians there that having a drink at a Christian event is sort of a questionable thing to do.

Why is this?

It’s certainly not because of the Bible. Jesus’ first miracle was turning water into wine at a wedding. And not just any wine. The kind of wine that made people think they saved the very best wine until the end. And you preachers who pervert the scriptures with your own extremely biased interpretations, here’s a news flash, people at parties don’t think the best wine is non-alcoholic grape juice. Religious people didn’t call Jesus “a glutton and a drunkard” because he ate communion loafers and grape juice all of the time.

Sheesh. It’s just so ridiculous to me.

And here’s the thing. I don’t even drink very much. I’ve never really been drunk, and I’m not advocating that people should just be foolish with their drinking or eating habits. But for crying out loud, this whole spiritualizing of alcohol being an inherently bad thing is so annoying. It’s mostly just an American thing, by the way (as well as places where America has exported these ideas with our missionaries). If you go most other places in the world, or anywhere else in history for that matter, Christians drink alcohol. Ever heard of a little thing called Communion? You know, the bread and the wine? That’s a pretty big deal in Christianity. Jesus didn’t pour out a cup of grape juice.

Man alive.

You know what the alcohol thing is based on? You ready for this? You sure?


Old people are the people that give the most money to Christian organizations like religious media outlets. And old people grew up in a time where alcohol was seen as a taboo social reality. Just like dancing or playing cards or “mixed bathing” (swimming). It’s based in an era of prohibition. These are old American values that we’re dealing with, not Christian values. It’s the old American people that have money that the Christian organizations do not want to offend. So they create an environment where drinking is seen as evil. If you want to start a television ministry, you can’t have it known to your donors that your staff likes to go out for drinks after work. So you implement rules for them. Do you know how common this is? I have friends that have lost their jobs over crap like this.

Do you see the irony of this? If you had been a disciple of Jesus and drank some of the wine of his first recorded miracle with him, you would be fired from a lot of the churches in this country. Shame on us.

So the point? (I haven’t forgotten) The point is that the industry that labels things as Christian and sells them to you has far more to do with marketing then Christianity. They are marketing to the mixed bag of values that has created the Evangelical Christian subculture. It’s a mix of some historically Christian values, some American values, and a whole lot of cultural boundary markers that set “us” apart from “them.” This sort of system makes us feel safe and right, and it makes some of its gatekeepers very wealthy and powerful.

The effect is then the filtering down of this subculture to people that don’t necessarily want to think through the viability of every one of these boundary markers, but in their simple desire to belong to what they consider the good guys, they acquiesce to the rules handed to them. At least in public. As the joke goes, why do you take two Baptists with you when you go fishing? Because if you only bring one, he’ll drink all your beer.

Here are some of the actual effects of this subculture though.

1. It makes us dishonest

When the foundation of the market and music you are trying to make is pretense, it’s very hard to be honest and successful. There is an unspoken assumption from most of us that we really want the people on the stage or on the book or album cover or on the radio need to have it together more than we do. Because we are messed up, we need them to be a sort of savior and hope for us. The result of this is that it’s often the people who are really good at pretending that they have it all together that make it to the stage and the book or album cover and the radio stations.

So Christians that would normally buy a beer don’t because they are in the Christian concert. Christian bands that smoke (which a lot of them if not most of them do, including some of my players) have to duck into back alleys as to not offend anybody. I think smoking is stupid. But I think it’s stupid because it smells bad and it kills you. I don’t use my religion to judge other people about it.

Rather than just being honest about where we are at and what we all struggle with though, we look to our gatekeepers to believe and live morally vicariously for us. That way we feel better about being part of the system of good, and the moral brokenness in our own lives is repressed like the fear of a child with her security blanket.

This sort of dishonesty is at the heart of much of what I and so many others find so repulsive about much of modern American Christendom

2. It kills creativity

I had a conversation with John Mark McMillan last night about something that I think is very interesting. By the way, I consider John Mark to be one of the ones I consider to be making a valiant effort in transcending some of these imposed limitations in this industry. But he mentioned to me how strange it is that people keep calling his new album “creative.” That word is actually one of the most used words when people describe our music as well. In fact, I bet some of you reading this have described as such. Here’s the weird thing about this…
Why do you find it necessary to say that?

Do you notice that nobody really uses that word about other types of music? I just was perusing some Itunes user reviews to see if this holds up. I checked John Mark and mine, and “creativity” is very often found. But it’s not often found in reviews of bands like Sigur Ros, Bon Iver, Radiohead, Sufjan Stevens or other artists who are certainly very “creative.”

Nobody goes to an art gallery and says, “boy, that painting is so creative.” Why? Because it’s art! Of course it’s creative! Why else would it be there? It’s very nature is creativity. Or like Lisa pointed out to me today, “that would be like saying, I love your house, it’s so architectural.”

But when someone in the Christian industry actually takes their art seriously, everybody is like “holy crap, listen to how creative it is!”
It’s like a person that’s been living among zombies for years seeing an actual human being and exclaiming, “wow, look at how clean her face is! She doesn’t even have any blood on it or anything!”

I’m not slamming the people that describe our music as creative. I appreciate the kindness that’s behind the words, but it does make me sad that the idea of creativity is so foreign to our industry that we have to actually point it out when someone actually sees the art as art and not zombie propaganda. Ok, that might have been a little much. But I like the sentence so I’ll leave it.

So that’s why I’m good at the Christian or secular game. I’ve seen behind the curtain, and I know the little man that’s pulling the levers, and he’s not impressive. I recognize his voice at this point, and it’s all over religious media.

Why am I writing this blog?

Some of you have commented in the past when I’ve been critical of the Christian music industry that I’m being hypocritical by still being a part of it. I don’t see it that way. I actually love a lot of the individual people in the industry. There really are some amazing people in it, many of who share my weariness about the way things have been. And I also love you guys. I love our fans. I love the people that we get to meet and I love being able to get our music to them. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try our best to purify the systems that we are part of. I just want to be honest about what I see and call us to find better ways of doing things.

Two quick recommendations and I’ll stop this blog that has already gone on WAY too long:

Consumers: I would suggest that you actively support those artists that you love that the industry hasn’t necessarily bought into. The cards are stacked against people that actually want to do honest creative art in this industry, and the people that try really need your direct help and support to have any chance. For us, we’ve had one guy for instance that has been sending us a check every month for years because he appreciates what we are trying to do. Do you know how much that one family has helped us stay encouraged? Even if it’s not a huge amount of money or anything, just having people behind you in this sort of battle is really helpful.

Industry people: Stop being so afraid. I know you want things to be different than they are as well. I know you want creativity to be valued as much as “Becky” analysis, but we need some of you to have some balls and make some decisions based on that value system. Yes money matters. But so does beauty. Art actually makes a difference in the world. Have the courage to actually make decisions on values and not simply on past numbers and trends. And for crying out loud, if it really is good, the numbers will follow eventually anyway.

Artists: Take heart. I think the tides may be turning. The recent attention and success of our band speaks to it I think. People are growing weary of the status quo. The machine and its sheen have seen its strongest days. So I encourage you as well to not be afraid. Your art is worth making even if the industry around you isn’t quite ready for it yet. Make it and let them catch up with you. Your art is sacred. Be honest. Be brave. And don’t let the markets or the industry be the final filter on your art, let your heart do that. Ok that’s all from me tonight.

Also read the very amusing comments on this blog here.

Oprah Winfrey praat met Rob Bell over hoe we naar God kijken, hoe we over hem spreken. Een ontdekkingstocht naar onze relatie met God, maar dan door een karakteristieke niet-traditionele bril.


Rob Bell is als spreker en schrijver iemand die taboes niet uit de weg gaat. In zijn vorige boek ‘Love Wins’ probeerde hij voorzichtig vraagtekens te zetten bij onze middeleeuwse opvattingen over de hel. Zijn vragen worden overigens niet altijd in dank afgenomen. Het raakt aan de zekerheid van vele gelovigen. Als we als gelovigen houvast vinden bij een aspect van God en dat aspect wordt op losse schroeven gezet door iemand als Rob Bell, dan doet dat stof opwaaien. Rob Bell bevraagt en herformuleert. Maar waarom? Is onze kijk op God niet goed?

De bril waar door we naar de bijbel kijken, is de bril waarmee we onszelf beperken en uiteindelijk God klein houden voor onszelf en anderen. Rob Bell moet gedacht hebben: ‘Durven we vragen te stellen bij onze opvattingen? Durven we twijfel toe te laten om tot een breder besef van God te komen?’


Without somehow destroying me in the process, how could God reveal himself in a way that would leave no room for doubt? If there were no room for doubt, there would be no room for me.

Fred Buechner




Twee perfecte danspartners

We hebben als jonge Christenen soms de neiging om ons zo vast te klampen aan God. In onze prilste ervaringen zoeken we duidelijke antwoorden.
We zijn als hele jonge kinderen die vragen of ze buiten mogen spelen, dan is een antwoord als ‘misschien’ of ‘straks’ veel te abstract en geeft onrust. Dat zie je ook terug bij ons als we net geloven. We zoeken dan duidelijk antwoorden zoals ‘ja’ en ‘nee’,  ‘goed’ en ‘fout’. Dit helpt ons om een in deze nieuwe geloofsdimensie staande te blijven.

Toch zie je dat veel gelovigen niet uit deze fase groeien en zich afschermen voor vragen die hun duidelijkheid aantasten. Wat op zich te begrijpen is, want waar duidelijkheid een nood is, zijn vragen en twijfels vijanden.
Maar kunnen geloof en twijfel niet juist twee perfecte danspartners zijn?

Twijfel helpt ons om ons juist sterker te worden in ons geloof. Een zwak geloof heeft niet geworsteld met twijfel en kan die spanning nog niet aan.

Rob Bell is die weg gegaan. Hij heeft de weg bewandelt waarin hij vragen is gaan stellen over de opvattingen die we hebben.
In Rob’s nieuwste boek ‘What we talk about, when we talk about God’ trekt hij onze  vastgeklonken opvattingen in twijfel. Maar hij laat het daar niet bij. Hij schetst ook nieuwe beelden in de hoop een breder beeld van God te kunnen omvatten. Zijn enthousiasme voor God merk je misschien niet in conservatieve uitspraken, maar proef je juist in zijn brede scala aan beelden en verhalen waarmee hij een vindingrijke en liefdevolle God schetst.

Zijn onze woorden die we gebruiken om te praten over God nog wel zuiver? Hebben we ze te vaak ijdel gebruikt? Of hebben we ze teveel beladen met onze oordelen?  Moeten we ze niet ontladen en uitwissen om tot nieuwe taal te komen die zegt wat we bedoelen?

Rob oppert om ons open te stellen voor het mysterie van God. Een mysterie roept vaak vragen op, maar ook een nieuwsgierigheid en ontdekkingsdrang om te zoeken naar nieuwe wegen om het verhaal van God te vertellen: ‘God is with us, God is for us, God is ahead of us’

‘God is met ons’

Een van de zere plekken die Rob aanraakt is het idee dat we van God iemand gemaakt hebben die ver weg is, afwezig, en soms opduikt en helpt.
En daarbij ontstaat het idee wij hier op aarde leven en Hij ver weg is en slechts facultatief is.

Terwijl het hebreeuwse woord ‘ruach / geest’ iets vertelt van een altijd aanwezig God. En deze Ruach / geest wordt in de moderne wereld gezien als iets geestelijks en minder ‘echt’. Terwijl het aardse wordt gezien als echt. Deze tweedeling zie je ook bij gelovigen, die juist focussen op het geestelijke en het aardse als ‘minder’ zien. Dus alles wat geestelijk is, is van God, en al het aardse is niet van God.

De kunst ligt volgens Rob in het opmerken van God in het leven van hier en nu, in het lijden en in de vreugde, in de ontmoeting met een vreemde, in momenten waar het fout gaat, in de worsteling, verdriet en gebrokenheid. 

‘God is voor ons’

Geloven we dat God wilt dat we bloeien? Dat er vrede op aarde is? Dat er betere kunst komt en meer goed eten? En wil God dat we de beste zorg geven aan de aarde? Wil God voor ons zijn en ons door onze moeilijkheden helpen? Wil hij heling brengen in de zoektocht van ons verleden en onze verslavingen?
En geldt dat al op aarde?

Jezus leerde ons bidden: ‘God, doe U wil op aarde, zoals ook in de hemel.’
Jezus zei niet, luister even, ik vertel je wat je moet doen, zodat je straks naar de hemel kan. Hij vertelt ons juist wat we moeten doen, zodat deze plek eruit gaat zien zoals God het zich voorstelt. Het koninkrijk is hier en nu en niet een evacuatie-theologie waarbij je moet zorgen om hier weg te komen.
Het gaat om het vinden van het leven op deze plek, hier en nu, waar de hemel en de aarde elkaar raken. Als je iemand vergeeft, als je vrijgevig bent, als je je oordeel voor je houdt, en als je van mensen houdt, als je opstaat tegen onrechtvaardigheid. Dan raakt de hemel de aarde.

‘God is ahead of us’

God is al vooruit gegaan en trekt ons allemaal mee in een betere toekomst. Vrede, gerechtigheid, schoonheid, liefde, gelijkheid. Hij geeft een belofte voor iets wat nu nog niet waarheid is geworden. Hoop is voor nu. Want nu is wat we hebben. Het verleden is voorbij en in de toekomst zijn we nog niet.
Soms zet een crisis of een uitdaging ons stil en brengt ons terug in het hier en nu. Als we een zware periode meemaken, kunnen we daarin leren hoe mooi het is om in het heden te leven.

Rob legt de vinger op de zere plek: Je kan een persoon zijn die heel geestelijk is en veel bijbelteksten kennen, bekend zijn in complexe theologische systemen, en toch niet een persoon zijn die ‘ziet’. Je kan je hoofd vullen met alle juiste doctrines. Maar het is totaal iets anders dan iemand ontmoeten in het hier en nu en naar die persoon luisteren en ervaren dat die persoon je meer te vertellen heeft dan alle boeken die je gelezen hebt.

Het kado

Rob sluit af met zijn wens dat meer mensen het besef mogen hebben dat ze geliefd zijn, dat de genade van God echt is en ook voor hen is. En dat mensen het unieke eeuwigstromende leven, waar Jezus het over heeft, zullen proeven en als reactie op dat kado zeggen: ‘Wat kan ik doen? Hoe kan ik meewerken? Dat ze hun taak, kunst, of werk mogen vinden waar ze warm van worden.



Posted by: In: Algemeen, van alles 04 Nov 2013 0 comments

In de media verscheen een half jaar geleden het verschrikkelijke nieuws dat Rick Warrens zoon zelfmoord heeft gepleegd na jarenlange depressie. Kloppen de ideeën die we als christenen hebben over depressie wel?

“Zelf ben ik enkele jaren flink depressief geweest,” vertelt Roald. “Ik heb gemerkt hoe onwennig mensen daarmee om konden gaan. Er werden me vanuit goede bedoelingen allerlei short-cuts aangeboden in verschillende soorten en maten. Mijn boekenplank ligt vol met boeken die ik kreeg van goed bedoelende kerkgenoten. En juist dat hielp uiteindelijk niet. Het signaal dat er mee gegeven werd, was: lees dit, want dan lost het je probleem op.”

“Na een lange periode begon ik me af te vragen of  er in eerste instantie wel acceptatie voor is. De goedbedoelde gebeden en adviezen gaven me eerder het gevoel dat mensen me uit het proces wilden trekken. Een enkeling durfde het aan om me in het proces te laten, zonder een welgemeende oplossing aan te dragen. En dat leverde die persoon wel een flink gevoel van machteloosheid op. In die periode heb ik gemerkt hoe krachtig het is als mensen durven het lijden te accepteren of zelfs met je mee durven te lijden. Wat voor moois gebeurt er dan: er ontstaat vertrouwen dat je het aankan, geloof vanuit de ander krijgt vorm in jou! Niet door woorden, maar door het lef van de ander. Het geloof dat aandurft in plaats van nep-geloof dat zelf wegvlucht voor het lijden.”

Jezus was niet bang
Roald: “Soms merk ik dat mensen die de Bijbel hanteerden als magische spreuken-boek minder boodschap hadden aan het accepteren van lijden. Zelf heb ik gelukkig gemerkt dat Jezus niet bang is geweest om met mij de depressie door te gaan en de angsten in de ogen te durven kijken. De manier van ‘redden’ was anders dan ik en anderen verwachtten. Juist door met mij in de diepte aanwezig te zijn, werd de angst en depressie draaglijk en ontwapend.”

Inmiddels gaat het beter met Roald en heeft hij draagkracht ontwikkeld voor de depressies. Hoe? “Door niet langer een fiks te vinden in allerlei geestelijke uitvluchten, maar door langzaam maar zeker meer houvast te vinden in vriendschappen en in laag tempo het lijden in mezelf en anderen te accepteren. Achteraf kijk ik terug naar een periode van depressie en merk ik dat de kerk een te makkelijk antwoord had die voor mij natuurlijk extreem aantrekkelijk was: God haalt je uit de put. Uiteindelijk ben ik blij dat er mensen met me in de put wilden zitten. Opmerkelijk was wel dat de mensen met de grootste geloofsuitspraken het minste durf hadden om naast me te staan.”

– Vandaag lanceert Roald om 12:00 de clip van zijn nummer ‘Barstensvol’.Check die clip hier.

– In de uitzending ‘Nederland zingt op Zondag’ sprak Roald met met Ds. van der Veer over zijn depressie en zijn zoektocht in de kerken naar erkenning.Bekijk de aflevering hier.


Ds. Arie van der Veer gaat op pad met zanger Roald Schaap. Hij was aanbiddingsleider en trad onder andere op tijdens Opwekking.

Roald ontdekte op zijn 26e dat hij depressief is, een nasleep van zijn jeugd waarin gevoel nauwelijks een rol speelde. In zijn kerk ervoer hij weinig ruimte om zijn gevoelens te tonen. Tijdens zijn depressie schreef hij het liedje ‘Barstensvol’. Roald zingt het lied voor ds. Arie van der Veer. Hoe lukte het Roald om dit lied te schrijven, uit zijn depressie te komen en te leren hiermee om te gaan?

Wil je de uitzending van Nederland Zingt van 3 november terug zien zonder onderbreking van koor en zang?

Klik hier

6 actievelingen vertellen over hoe zij de wereld vlakbij een beetje beter maken.
Verbeter de wereld, begin in je buurt


Van ‘halleluja’ tot ‘geef een vluchteling te eten’
Vervoering, contemplatie, een persoonlijke relatie met het Goddelijke. Daar denk je aan als je aan kerkmuziek denkt. Maar ondanks de aandacht voor naastenliefde in de kerk, gaan de liedjes grotendeels over de relatie met God en niet over de strijd tegen maatschappelijk onrecht, vindt Roald Schaap (33).
Daar brengt hij met zijn liedjes verandering in. “Als artiest treed ik veel op in kerken. Ik had het gevoel dat daar, zeker in de muziek, steeds een goede persoonlijke relatie met God werd benadrukt. Maar kerkmuziek gaat niet vaak over de relatie met de mensen om ons heen die het moeilijk hebben.” Door middel van zelfgemaakte liedjes en teksten wil Schaap mensen uitdagen om te zien wat er in hun omgeving gebeurt en welke rol zij kunnen spelen. Bijvoorbeeld de situatie van mensen die zonder papieren in Nederland verblijven, een groep waarvoor hij zich zelf inzet.
Hij zwengelt bovendien een kerkelijke discussie aan. Zijn nieuwe album ‘Hout en Steen’ is vergezeld van een boek met prikkelende columns over maatschappelijk onrecht en een reactie daarop van bekende theologen en kerkleiders. Bovendien bevat het boek opdrachten zoals: nodig een vluchteling uit om samen te eten. Schaap: “God wil dat je meewerkt aan een betere wereld, in plaats van de praktijk van het ‘goede doen’ alleen maar te bespreken.” Zijn folkmuziek is dan ook niet alleen bedoeld voor in de kerk, maar vooral ook voor daarbuiten. www.roald.tv

Lees het bericht hier op www.myworld.com